Episode 3 Season 6: How Jesus Modeled Healthy Boundaries

[00:00:03] Hello, Beloveds, and welcome to Christian Emotional Recovery, a podcast for those who are survivors of childhood trauma, emotional neglect, and narcissistic abuse. This podcast is hosted by Rachel Leroy, a college professor and trauma survivor.

[00:00:23] Many of us spend years trying to heal and don't get anywhere. We don't always target the trauma itself, which is so often what keeps us stuck. This podcast is where faith meets science. Rachel is an emotional healing expert with 20 years of experience applying healing modalities that helped her start making progress after nothing else worked. She'll show you how to do the same.

[00:00:51] Each week, we'll cover a topic that will show you how to heal trauma for good. Please check out our website and show notes at ChristianEmotionalRecovery.com and join the Facebook community, Trauma Survivors Unite, Christian Emotional Recovery.

[00:01:09] Hello, everyone, and welcome to Season 6, Episode 3 of Christian Emotional Recovery. I'm your host, Rachel Leroy, and this is Episode 3 of Season 6. The episode today will focus on how Jesus modeled healthy boundaries. How Jesus modeled healthy boundaries. Before we get started, just real quick, if you'd like to donate to the podcast, that would be greatly appreciated. It allows me to continue to do the work that I'm doing.

[00:01:46] That's what I'm doing and to help other people. It pays for the housing and the the there's a lot of stuff that goes into, you know, making the podcast and housing it and all that. It's about a hundred and something dollars a month that I pay for. So that helps me to be able to pay for that and to continue to do this work. There are three ways you can do it. You can buy me a coffee. You can, and that's, I can't remember the name of the site, but it's, it's linked on all the ways of how to donate.

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[00:03:05] So those are links that I'll put in the show notes. There's also a free resource of, some free resources on the website and I'll put those links in the show notes as well. So check those all out. Let's go ahead and jump straight in to how Jesus modeled healthy boundaries. So the theme here is Jesus had strong loving boundaries and so should we. Episode highlights what we'll talk about is that Jesus walked in love, but never allowed others to control or manipulate him.

[00:03:32] Both and it's not either or. Growing up, I had an example of some people that would just do whatever the heck they wanted. They would take from other people. They didn't care. They would run over you if it was inconvenient for them not to. And there was just no boundaries and they would just like set hard boundaries in some cases where maybe they shouldn't have.

[00:03:55] And then I learned from another person that being selfless meant sacrificing your health, your mental health, your own needs, and just allowing if anybody ever needed anything, no matter what it was under any circumstances, it was your Christian duty to do it, no matter what it cost you. I'm not saying there's no sacrifice, but neither of those is balanced. So we're going to do a balanced approach to healthy boundaries through the eyes and lens of Jesus and our faith.

[00:04:19] So examples of Jesus setting boundaries is in Mark 135 through 38 and another one is in Luke 5 16 and another is in Luke 21 through 8. And we'll talk about those in some detail. And then we'll talk about specifically, since this is important for this audience, how trauma and abuse survivors can set Christ-like boundaries. How trauma and abuse survivors can set Christ-like boundaries. Responding to pushback and guilt trips. I bet we all know a little bit about that. I know I do.

[00:04:47] And possible calls to action that we'll talk about are practicing saying no in some small way this week. And focusing on let your yes be yes and your no be no. And I'll also talk about a book that has really helped me that is a Christian book and it's about setting boundaries. A lot of the resources here are Christian-based and some of them are not. So just keep that in mind as you go through. I believe that there are a lot of great resources out there, both Christian and general, that can be helpful.

[00:05:15] And so that's what I do here. Science and faith come together on this podcast to help you to find strategies and healing modalities that will help you finally heal when you haven't been able to heal in the past. Okay? So let's talk about how Jesus modeled healthy boundaries. Loving other people without losing yourself. So many people struggle with boundaries, right? Especially trauma survivors. Especially people who have codependency and attachment trauma, trauma bonds.

[00:05:44] So especially us, those people, these people struggle with boundaries because they associate them with selfishness. A lot of Christians who are codependent and or empaths and or highly sensitive and or are abuse or trauma survivors are more sensitized to this and more likely to have been taught that if they set any kind of boundary, they're selfish. And there's a lot of overbearing, manipulative, narcissistic type people that will tell you you're being unloving and that you're being selfish.

[00:06:14] If you set any kind of boundary, even if it's healthy, even if it's self-preservation in some cases. And I'm here to tell you that that's a bunch of BS. It's not selfish to set healthy boundaries. It's actually not good for the people you want to help to not set them because if you completely deplete yourself and you let people run roughshod all over you and you don't have some balance in what you do and what you say yes to and what you say no to, then you will have no energy left to really do what you're called to do to help other people.

[00:06:44] So having that actually preserves you. And Jesus did that for that very reason. Set boundaries. Got away from the crowds. Said no at times. He said yes a lot of the time. Yes, he helped a lot of people. But there were also times where he just got away. He had to because he was human and he had a human body. And we are too. And if you have trauma survivor symptoms such as chronic illness, you even need to set more boundaries and protect yourself even more. And that's also okay. Okay.

[00:07:14] So some of the things that you might hear, I want you to be able to identify these things so that you don't let people manipulate you. And so you can identify potential forms of mistreatment and or abuse. Now, if somebody says one of these to you once, that doesn't mean that they're abusive or you're in an abusive relationship. Sometimes people step over the line. And sometimes if you tell them if they're a good person, they'll be like, oh, I'm sorry.

[00:07:40] But somebody who's truly narcissistic or has high narcissistic traits and is an unhealthy person or is abusive, they will do this chronically. They will say multiple ones of these to you at different times and they will not apologize or back down. Or they will apologize and back down and then start doing it again very quickly and chronically. So those are some things to watch out for. Some phrases to watch out for in protecting yourself with people that try to manipulate you.

[00:08:09] They'll say and they'll use Christianity. They'll use Jesus and they'll use God to try to guilt you. That's even more messed up. That's why with faith, it gets you have to even be more careful to understand how this stuff works because people will twist things that are intended to be good into something unhealthy and not good. One of them is if you say if I say no, I'm being unloving. Somebody might say, well, you're not very loving. That's not very Christian of you. You're selfish.

[00:08:37] And another one is if I disappoint someone, I've failed God because you feel like you can't disappoint someone. A lot of Christians are people pleasers. A lot of codependent Christians are people pleasers. A lot of codependent non-Christians are people pleasers. And they might say, well, I failed that person or I failed myself or I failed my ideals. And again, that's not necessarily true. And then if someone is upset with my boundary, I must be doing something wrong. Somebody might tell you, well, you're not following God.

[00:09:06] You're not being Christ-like. Just because you set a boundary or say no doesn't necessarily mean you're being selfish, un-Christ-like, or ungodly or doing anything wrong. So be careful for that one too. A good Christian should always be available. Oh, my butt and six others. Sorry. I was about to say something else. But that is not true. That is just not true. You can't always be available. You have to turn off. You have to unplug. You have to take a break.

[00:09:35] That's just being human. You're not selfish if you're not available to somebody 24-7. There might be exceptions, like if you have a baby or something. But even then, if you are human, you may need to let somebody babysit so you can get some sleep if you have that option. I understand not everybody has that option at all times. But if there's a way to find a way to get a break, you need to do that for yourself. And then, but also, Jesus was the most loving person who ever lived.

[00:10:04] He had boundaries. He healed people. He served people. He loved people. And he even sacrificed for people. And those are things we're called to do. But within balance, within reality, and within what we can do. Okay? He also walked away from crowds. He said no to demands at times. He refused manipulation.

[00:10:27] Think about how many times the Pharisees and the Sadducees and Satan and other people like that manipulated Jesus. And Jesus never talked hostile to anybody except for people that acted like that. That acted high and mighty and like they were better than you. And that they had all the answers. And that you're not good enough. And they were up on their pedestal. But God called them empty, whitewashed tombs. And he would not let them manipulate him.

[00:10:55] He confronted their harmful behavior. He confronted other types of harmful behavior. The Bible talks about some of the things that it says the Lord detests. And those are types of things where people tend to be highly narcissistic if they are engaging in a lot of those activities all the time. Like malice and slander and smearing and manipulation and hostility and conflict. Now we all have moments like that where we have conflict. And anger is normal. And conflict is normal.

[00:11:24] But I'm talking about people that seek it out. People that enjoy it. People that if you don't do what they say, they throw a tantrum. Stuff like that. Jesus also prioritized his relationship with the Father. There were times where he's like, I need to recharge. I need to go and talk to my dad. I need to go talk to the Father. I need to talk to God. And then he did not allow others to determine his purpose. And as Jesus set an example for us, we're allowed to walk away from crowds.

[00:11:54] We're allowed to say no to demands. We're allowed to refuse manipulation. As a matter of fact, we're called to refuse manipulation. That's one we should do all the time. We should confront harmful behavior at times. We should prioritize our relationship with God. And we should not allow others to determine our purpose. Just like Jesus. So Jesus shows us that boundaries are not barriers to love. They protect the ability to love well. Like I said earlier, if you're just give, give, give, give, give, give, give,

[00:12:23] and you don't have boundaries or people are coming to you all the time, needing and wanting you or things from you, that will drain you. And you have to have boundaries and you have to have standards where you can help people, but also say no. There's also people that will take advantage of it. But there are some people that will just keep take, take, take, take, take, and they never seem to be able to. Now, there are people who have disabilities and stuff, but these people never seem to be able to get a job.

[00:12:50] Again, I'm not talking about people with mental or physical disabilities or health problems. I'm talking about people who can at least work some of the time. I'm also aware not everybody can work full time. I can't, but I still work when I can and I do what I can. And they'll just take, take, take, take, take. Every time they need something, they pick up the phone and call. Do they ever pick up the phone and call, say, how are you doing? Do they ever pick up the phone and just get an update? No, they don't.

[00:13:17] Telling them this over and over and other people telling this over and over, there are times they say no, especially when it's something where the person dug themselves into a deep pit and people warned them and they still kept digging and digging and digging. And they're like, stop, stop. And they just kept on and on. You get the idea. And then they say, help get me out of the pit. And they're like, no. Or they're like, I'll do this, but I won't do that. Like, I'll give you some resources, but I will not rescue you. You cannot live with me.

[00:13:46] You know, things like that. It's okay to set boundaries. The Bible does talk about, I was a stranger. You took me in. I was thirsty. You gave me something to drink. I was hungry and you gave me something to eat. But I don't think that was ever meant to be applied to every single situation without exception, no matter how dire it was for you or that person. I think there is a context there to consider when you make those decisions. More times than not, we should help the person. And there might be cases where somebody has dug themselves in and you still need to help them.

[00:14:16] But I'm just saying boundaries allow you to love people and you can enable people if you just give, give, give, give, give, and there's no boundaries at all. That can actually not only be bad for you, but bad for them. And Jesus set boundaries for people, not only for himself, but for the other person. When the woman at the well came to him, he was kind to her. He did not judge her. He did not condemn her. The only thing he said was go and sin no more. And he meant that.

[00:14:41] And she, that changed her because of how loving he was, because he wasn't judging her and condemning her and pointing fingers at her like the people that would have wanted to stone her or, you know, the woman that had the, um, the, the woman who was called an adultery, by the way, where was the man? I don't know. But anyway, you get what I'm saying that Jesus loved people. He did tell them what was right from wrong and encouraged them to follow right from wrong, but he loved people. And he set boundaries, especially with the people, not the woman at the well.

[00:15:11] He didn't talk hostily to her. He talked hostily to the people who were uppity and high and mighty and thought they were better than everybody else. And we're talking and looking down on the sinners, so to speak. We're all sinners. Nobody's immune from that except for Jesus. So, okay, a little bit about what are healthy boundaries. So a boundary is a clear understanding of what belongs to you, of what belongs to someone

[00:15:36] else, of what you're responsible for, of what you're not responsible for, of what behaviors you will participate in, and of what behaviors you will step away from. So I'll say that again. Healthy boundaries are not about controlling other people. It's about what belongs to me, what belongs to someone else, what am I responsible for, what am I not responsible for, what behaviors will I participate in, and what behaviors will I not participate in.

[00:16:03] So if there's a bunch of drama going on and you're like, I'm not doing this, that's setting a boundary of what you'll not participate in. I could go on and on with examples of this, but I won't get into all the details. But boundaries are not about controlling other people. They're about managing your own choices, access, time, energy, space, and responses. So they're about managing your own choices, access, time, energy, space, and responses.

[00:16:29] A boundary says I cannot control what you do, but I can control how I respond. I can't control what you do, but I can control how I respond. So Jesus loved people without being controlled by people. That's another thing. Jesus loved people without being controlled by people. One of the most important things we see in Jesus's life was that he was deeply compassionate, but he was not controlled or manipulated by others' expectations.

[00:16:54] He was kind, and a lot of what he did pleased other people, but his most important priority was pleasing God. And sometimes pleasing God comes into direct conflict with pleasing another person. In that case, you choose to please God. And of course, there are times you need to please yourself. I don't mean that in a selfish way, but there's times you need to just do something good for yourself, and that's okay too. But Jesus was not controlled by others' expectations. He was not codependent. He was not a people pleaser.

[00:17:24] So an example, Jesus saying no to demands. And like I said, Mark 1, 35 through 38 is one scripture where he does that. He healed many people. The crowds searched for him, and he told his disciples, said, everybody's looking for you, so you might even have other people come to you and tell you that other people have expectations of you. And so people needed him. People wanted him. People expected him to continue.

[00:17:50] But his response was, let us go somewhere else to the nearby villages so I can preach there also. So he had to also balance the needs of multiple people. If you have multiple children or multiple people that depend on you, that's another thing. You have to balance your own needs with prioritizing the needs of different people. And so in this case, Jesus was going to attend to the needs of other people as well. He did not allow urgency, popularity, or other people's needs to define his mission.

[00:18:18] Other people's needs are important, but they did not define his mission. So someone needing you does not automatically mean God is calling you to say yes. I'll say it again. Someone needing you does not automatically mean God is calling you to say yes. Number three, Jesus prioritized rest and connection with God. That's where you're putting God first and your relationship with God first and taking care of yourself. At times, you need to take care of yourself first. That is important.

[00:18:44] It's a cliche for a reason, but you cannot put the oxygen mask on the person next to you if you pass out. You have to put the oxygen mask on yourself first. This is not about selfish indulgences. It's about basic needs. And then, of course, there are times where you need to allow yourself to indulge a little bit. But when it comes to basic needs, you have to take care of your own needs. There's even a resource called Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs.

[00:19:10] And basically, you can't meet another need until you meet the one below it. And it's like this pyramid. I might try to share it with you. But that's based on years and decades of science and psychology research. And if, for example, if somebody's starving and they don't have any clean water or medical care and their kid is sick and you just go to some mission field and give them Bibles, that's not, in my opinion, the right thing to do.

[00:19:39] You need to first take care of their needs. Make sure that they're fed and that they have water, clean water, and that they have medical care and that they have their basic needs met. And then maybe they'll be open to the other. But that's not, you see what I'm saying. I'm not going to get into all that either. But Jesus prioritized rest and connection with God. Jesus withdrew to lonely places and prayed. Lonely here, I think, just means solitude, not like where he felt alone.

[00:20:07] He had God's presence and he probably was enjoying the solitude, I would assume. So he went to a place where there was nobody else and prayed. Jesus didn't withdraw because he was lazy. He withdrew because he understood that spiritual, emotional, and physical renewal were necessary. And there's a lot of examples of that in the Bible. Like when Elijah was so wiped out that he just wanted to die. And Jesus didn't, God didn't condemn him. He didn't say, get up. What's wrong with you of little faith?

[00:20:36] He fed him. He let him rest. He embodied a presence for him to be comforted. And he just gave him space. He took care of his basic needs, those bottom, the bottom part of the Maslow Pyramid, and then went from there. Okay? So he modeled, Jesus modeled solitude, rest, reflection, and reconnection with God. So how does this connect for trauma and abuse survivors? Well, many trauma survivors struggle with rest because their nervous system learned,

[00:21:05] I must stay alert. I must stay alert. And so on. You can see a blinking light, like a blinker. Just saying that over and over. I have to take care of everyone. I have to take care of everyone. My needs don't matter. My needs don't matter. You might not even say those things consciously in your mind, but your unconscious mind is probably saying them. But people with histories of neglect or abuse often become hyper-independent or chronic caretakers. Let me say that again.

[00:21:32] People with histories of neglect or abuse often become hyper-independent or chronic caretakers. And those can be codependent signs. You're like, but codependent means you're dependent on somebody else. There are several forms of attachment that you can have and be codependent. And hyper-independent can be one of those. If you're a chronic caretaker and don't want anybody taking care of you, you still need other people's approval. And that's why you're a caretaker, because you don't have the boundaries. Not because you're a caretaker, but because you're a chronic one and you don't know when to stop, so to speak.

[00:22:02] So Jesus demonstrates that rest is not selfish. Rest is part of being human. Jesus also did not engage in every argument. This is one I've learned in the last few years. I'm not going to get involved in other people's drama. I will back up. Beep, beep, beep. Beep, beep. Like one of those trucks hit reverse if somebody starts trying to dig up conflict for its own sake. Again, that doesn't... A lot of us survivors are also wary of any kind of conflict.

[00:22:30] There are times you have to stand up for yourself, and potentially there might be some conflict. But that's different than somebody trying to start something. And that's also different than someone bringing their concerns to you in a loving way. Does that make sense? We should listen to other people's concerns in a loving way. Just because we have an argument with somebody doesn't mean that that's drama. Because if we love somebody, there's going to be times where that happens. But you see what I'm saying. He didn't engage in every argument, though.

[00:22:58] In Luke 21 through 8, the religious leaders questioned Jesus and tried to trap him, like I was talking about. They were not seeking understanding. They were seeking control, and they were trying to trick him. They were trying to manipulate him and make him look like a fool and try to trip him up. And so that's the difference. When Nicodemus came to Jesus and had questions, he was questioning, but it was different. He wasn't trying to trick or trap Jesus. So he listened to him, and he was patient.

[00:23:28] But with the people that had the manipulation and the narcissistic response to things, he responded in a different way. He set a clear boundary and said, nah, we're not doing this. Jesus recognized the motive behind the conversation and refused to participate in pointless debate. So the lesson here is not every accusation requires a defense. There are times where I've just been like, you know what?

[00:23:53] But I'm just going to let them think it, especially if there's somebody that I know already thinks doesn't think very much of me, and I've tried to seek their approval, and they've done nothing but be hostile and abusive. Who cares what they think? I know that's easier said than done, but really, who cares what somebody like that thinks? Sometimes it's best just to let them think what they think, because you're not going to change their mind. Not every conflict requires engagement. Some do, but a lot of them don't. Not every person deserves unlimited access to your emotional energy.

[00:24:23] I would say most people don't. But not every person deserves unlimited access to your emotional energy. Jesus also confronted harmful behavior. Boundaries are not only about saying no, sometimes they're involved in speaking the truth. I'll say it again. Sometimes boundaries involve speaking the truth. That doesn't mean every time you see somebody doing something wrong, you need to go point it out to them. That's not our place, in my opinion. But there might be times where we need to speak up about something that's wrong.

[00:24:50] For example, I've been around people I know and they've made some racist comment. And I would say something like, please don't say things like that around me. I don't like it. I'll say something kind like that. You know, or you get what I'm saying. You stand up for somebody that's being bullied or something like that. An example of that, and I'm not saying we should go in a church and turn the tables. There are some corrupt churches out there, and I will not get into that, and I will not get specific there.

[00:25:18] But there's a lot more corruption in the church, I think, now, especially in the United States, than there's ever been. But in Jesus, in Matthew 21, 12 through 13, Jesus confronted exploitation and corruption. He did not confuse kindness with passivity, forgiveness with enabling, or love with allowing harm. So he cleansed the temple.

[00:25:41] I think that's where he overturned the tables, because there was, people were just profiting off of God for their own gain. They weren't just like, okay, well, I'm helping people and I'm making a living at the same time. I don't think there's anything wrong with that if it's done right. Like, a teacher or a preacher has to have a salary, and it's okay to be comfortable. But I'm talking about, we won't get into it, but like these extreme prosperity gospel preachers.

[00:26:08] I think that's the kind of thing that Jesus was turning over the temple, the tables in the temple about. They were selling stuff for sacrifices, and it was the context of the situation that was wrong, not just the situation itself. But anyway, so the important trauma recovery connection here is many survivors struggle because they were taught, keep the peace, don't make people angry, forgive and forget.

[00:26:30] And if we were around people, especially adults who had bad tempers, and if we did certain things, they would fly off the handle or get abusive, then we're even more scared of standing up and speaking up and speaking the truth or confronting harmful behavior. And in those situations, there wasn't much we could do. We probably didn't even know we could do it, and so we just stayed quiet.

[00:26:53] But as adults, even when it's scary, there are times, I forgot who said it, but even if you're trembling, sometimes you need to say something. Like, say you love somebody when you're scared to say it, or say something was hurtful when you're scared to say it, or stand up for something, or stand up for what's right in certain situations. So many survivors struggle because they were taught, keep the peace, don't make people angry, forgive and forget.

[00:27:18] But biblical forgiveness does not mean tolerating abuse, allowing repeated harm, removing consequences, staying in unsafe situations. Jesus forgave people while still calling people to repentance and change. And repentance isn't about condemnation. It's about encouraging and inviting people to change their mind and to make a different choice and to make a better choice.

[00:27:43] Okay, so it's important to know that that does not always mean avoiding conflict altogether, but it also means you don't tolerate abuse, allow harm, repeated harm, remove consequences, or stay in unsafe situations, you or anybody else. So Jesus and boundaries with family expectations. Jesus with his family, he set boundaries with them. His family came looking for him while he was teaching.

[00:28:08] And if you know anything about Jewish culture at the time, it was a man's duty to provide for his family. And it was a man's duty to get married and have children. And Jesus did not always, he did work and he did help his family. Let me say that he did not completely abandon them. He was a carpenter, he was a fisherman, and I'm sure some of that paid for his ministry, but I don't know. He could have sent some of that home to his mother and his sisters and his family too.

[00:28:36] So I think there's probably a balance there. I'm just reading between the lines. He did not reject his family, but he clarified his priorities and identity. And the priorities might have been different at different times. He might have prioritized his ministry at one time, but maybe if his niece was very sick, he might have come home and healed her. We don't know, but I'm just saying that it's a balance. He said he understood that he had a purpose beyond meeting everyone's expectations though.

[00:29:03] And trauma connection, how does that connect to survivors of neglect, abuse, and trauma? So many people from dysfunctional backgrounds struggle with guilt, obligation, fear of disappointing others, and feeling responsible for everyone's emotions. I understand that and I'm sure most of us do. That's where it's called FOG, fear, obligation, and guilt. If you see somebody heaping that on you, go the other way. That is not okay. Fear, obligation, and guilt causes a FOG.

[00:29:33] And that's a great acronym and metaphor for that whole set of things there, set of emotions. So the psychology of healthy boundaries. We talked about how Jesus sets healthy boundaries, but I want to also kind of like in the other episode, talk about the psychology and the science behind it. So research does strongly support the benefit of healthy boundaries. We've had podcast episodes and we've had YouTube videos that have talked about that and other resources.

[00:30:02] But boundaries improve, first of all, emotional regulation. Trauma often disrupts a person's sense of safety and control. Survivors can struggle with people-pleasing, difficulty in saying no, fear of conflict, over-explaining, and guilt when prioritizing themselves. And I've struggled with all of those. I've gotten much better and I'm still learning and I'm still learning. Healthy boundaries restore a sense of agency. I've used that word a lot on this channel.

[00:30:31] You have a sense of agency and no one has a right to take that from you. God is the only sovereign over you and then you have sovereignty over yourself. That doesn't mean you're completely selfish and you only think of yourself, but it means when it comes to making choices and setting boundaries, God is the umbrella and then you are underneath that and then everything else comes after that.

[00:30:56] Again, I don't mean not sacrificing at other times for other people or putting other people ahead of yourself, but I'm talking about when it comes to making choices. If you do that, it needs to be your choice. You don't need to have been manipulated or controlled into doing it. Healthy boundaries also restore a sense of agency by, I have choices. I can protect my peace. And that's another thing about setting boundaries. One of the fruits of the spirit is peace.

[00:31:24] And to have peace, you have to set boundaries. Period. And you cannot always please people. I can respond instead of react. I choose to respond instead of reacting. This supports emotional regulation and reduces chronic stress. So I've had people, especially manipulative, controlling people, put me on the spot and try to use fear, obligation, and guilt. And they'll be in your face in the moment, like on the phone or in person. And they'll be like, oh, we're doing this, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

[00:31:53] And we need you to blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. So what I've learned, because I will go blank and then I'll say something I shouldn't, like either be hostile or and rude, or I'll give in and just do what they want. And neither of those is a healthy response there. I take time to think about it. So when I get put on the spot like that, I've learned to have a trigger reaction that is actually a choice, though. And I say, I'll get back to you on that. And if they're pushy about it, I'll say, I'll get back to you on that again.

[00:32:23] And that gives you a chance to think about it and figure out how you want to respond without being manipulated in the moment. Because I know a lot of us survivors go blank. And so having that and practicing that as a response is a good way to protect yourself. And it's more likely to de-escalate the situation. Not always, but it usually does. So another one is boundaries reduce codependency patterns. I talked about that already.

[00:32:51] Codependency often develops in environments where a person learns, my worth comes from helping others. Other people's emotions are my responsibility. I must keep everyone happy to be safe. Healthy boundaries help people separate compassion from responsibility. You can care about someone's pain without taking ownership of their choices if they're an adult. Keep in mind here, if it's a child, there's a different set of rules. That doesn't mean they're not responsible for their choices if they're a little older.

[00:33:18] But like a two-year-old, you can't expect them to just know how to respond, you know? So it depends on the context, obviously. Boundaries improve relationships. Boundaries improve relationships. That's another benefit. Healthy relationships require honesty, mutual respect, emotional safety, and autonomy. Each person in the relationship needs to have their own free will respected by the other person or people.

[00:33:45] So without boundaries, relationships become resent-filled, controlling, and emotionally exhausting. And that's where enmeshment comes in. Enmeshment is when people have no boundaries in a relationship, and they're just running all over each other, being abused and abusing, and maybe in some cases both. Paradoxically, boundaries often create deeper intimacy because people know where they stand. They feel safe, okay? The next one, boundaries help heal trauma responses.

[00:34:13] Trauma responses are fight, flight, freeze, and fawn. Those are the classic ones. Fight, I must control everything. And maybe getting, just getting in the person's face, like overreacting. Flight, I must stay busy and avoid feelings. Freeze, I cannot speak up. Fawn, I must please everyone. And so a lot of us may be more prone to one or two of those, but we've all gone back and forth between them all at a certain time. And it might be one situation that triggers one response

[00:34:43] and another situation that triggers another response. Being aware of when that happens and knowing how to respond will help you to have a more healthy response. No, easier said than done. But there's a start, and you work on it, and you get better at it gradually. Boundaries specifically help people heal the fun response. A person learns, I can disappoint someone and still be loved. Or I'd say it's safe to disappoint someone at times, and it's okay.

[00:35:11] I can say no and still be a good person. I'll say it again. I can say no and still be a good person or a good Christian. I can protect myself without becoming cruel. I can protect myself without becoming cruel. So if there's somebody who's really abusive, and you have to set a hard boundary, you don't have to get into it and get in a fight with them. You just gray rock them, and don't say more than you have to, and be polite, and have basic courtesy, and don't let anything escalate.

[00:35:40] And if the push comes to shove, you can just get out of that situation, even if it ticks the person off. You're not being cruel. You're protecting yourself if the person's that unsafe. How do you practice Christ-like boundaries? Small. When you learn something new, you're going to feel uncomfortable. You're going to feel like, oh, I don't know if I can do this. But you stand your ground if you know it's the right thing to do. The first few times I set boundaries, I felt scared to death.

[00:36:08] But as I did it more, I started to feel more okay with it. I'm not saying I'm always comfortable with it, but it does get better if you consistently stand your ground. If you make a mistake, you forgive yourself, and you try again. But practice saying I can't commit to that right now. Let me think about it before I answer. I told you that was one you can do when there are manipulative people that know that if they put you on the spot that they'll trap you.

[00:36:35] Well, if you have a response ready that's polite but sets a boundary, that's very smart. That doesn't work for me is another thing you can say. I understand you're upset, but my decision stands. I love you, but I cannot continue this conversation while we are yelling. Those are ways that you can set kind boundaries and not do harm. Let me say them again. I can't commit to that right now. Let me think about it before I answer. So you're not necessarily saying no, but you're not leaping into a commitment.

[00:37:04] What the Bible says is let your yes be yes and your no be no. It's better to say you'll not do something and then do it than to say you'll do something and not. You see what I'm saying? That doesn't work for me is another one. I understand you're upset, but my decision stands. I love you, but I cannot continue this conversation while we are yelling. Those are some examples and there are a lot more. Handling pushback and guilt trips. Ooh, this is a big one, right?

[00:37:31] Some of the things they say, knowing that it's manipulation. Some of us have been manipulated so badly and groomed so badly, especially in childhood, that some of these phrases, we don't even know it's abuse and manipulation. So that's why I like to help you to identify specific phrases to look out for. Now, if somebody says one of these once in a while when they're upset or angry, that doesn't mean that they're a manipulator or an abuser.

[00:37:57] But if they use these or ones like these chronically over and over again, then there's a good chance that they are. So misconception, if someone is upset by my boundary, my boundary must be wrong. Not necessarily. So that's something I've also learned. Somebody else's opinion is more important than mine. So if I think something different, my opinion must be less valid. I don't know where I learned that, but there was a family pattern there that certain people, there's a hierarchy.

[00:38:26] Nobody says it. Nobody talks about it. But there's a hierarchy where certain people's needs and opinions are more valid and more prevalent than other people's. And if that's the case, that is wrong. That is wrong. So if someone is upset by my boundary or their opinion is more valid than mine, my boundary must be wrong or my opinion must be wrong. Not necessarily. Two people can have different opinions and neither one of them may be wrong. Or one person might be wrong and the other one's not.

[00:38:56] But sometimes people's anger is information. A healthy person may say, I don't like this, but I respect your choice. Or they might be like, well, I'm disappointed, but that's your decision. That's what a healthy, loving person does. They're still human, but they are respectful of your boundary. An unhealthy person or an abusive person may say, after everything I've done for you, nobody uses what they've done for somebody to manipulate them.

[00:39:22] It's one thing if somebody just gives, gives, gives, gives, gives, and the other person never even says thank you. And then they say something about how harmful or hurtful that is. That's not the same thing as this. After everything I've done for you, you're selfish. You don't love me. You're changing. A boundary often reveals relationship patterns. When you start setting boundaries, even loving people sometimes will not like it at first. And abusive people definitely won't.

[00:39:49] But you have to set your ground and the person will eventually adapt to it. Or you just have to take yourself somewhere else. That is a little bit about the psychological benefits of setting boundaries. I'll just say them really quickly one more time. Some of the psychological benefits of healthy boundaries were they reduce codependency. They improve emotional regulation. They improve relationships. They help heal trauma responses.

[00:40:17] And then we talked about how to practice Christlike boundaries and handling pushback. So a book that's helped me is a book on boundaries. I think it's called Boundaries, but it's by Henry Cloud. And he's got a whole channel on boundaries. And he's Christian. He does Christian teachings. And so if you prefer Christian teachers, he's up that alley.

[00:40:41] He's really good about balance and about kindness and about, you know. But he's got a book on boundaries. And it really, really helped me. It's actually very practical. Some Christian books are not always practical. But this one's actually very practical. It gives a lot of applicable examples in real life. It's grounded. It's balanced. And so I would give you that book, Henry Cloud Boundaries, as a recommendation.

[00:41:10] He also has a YouTube channel. And I think he has a website. And I'll try to put those in the show notes as well. So you can refer to those as a resource. But there's a lot of free stuff there. And I think he has a paid tier as well. So refer to the article. I refer to the article on not pushing people away as well, where Henry Cloud talks about the balance here. There's another side of this. When I talk about boundaries, I'm not talking about every time somebody makes a mistake,

[00:41:40] you just cut them out of your life. I know people that do that. I know people that have never stayed in a long-term relationship because they don't have any balance in terms of allowing the other person to be human. There is a balance here. And Henry Cloud talks about this in a relevant magazine article. I think this came out 2025 or this year. But he talks about how boundaries were never meant to push people away.

[00:42:06] We're talking about the loving people, not the people who are toxic, chronically toxic. And there's a gray area with some people where maybe you interact with them some, but a little less because they're kind of unhealthy, but they're not completely unsafe. They're just not completely safe either. But setting boundaries is healthy. And going no contact can be important as well. But sometimes I wonder if we've overdone that.

[00:42:35] There are people that need to go no contact with their parents, with their siblings, with an ex, with an old friend, with an old schoolmate, because they are just flat out toxic. Or there's a time period in their life where they just cannot deal with that person. And then when they get healthier, maybe if there's somebody that's in that gray area, they can kind of have a relationship with them. I'm kind of that way with certain family members. And then there's certain family members I have to set hard boundaries with. And then there's safe family members and friends, right? I think boundaries, I think there's a balance there.

[00:43:05] If somebody steps on your toe, you just don't, you don't, you're not like, well, I'm, that's it. We're over. Some people take it to that point. I'm oversimplifying. But this article talks about the purpose of setting boundaries and Henry Cloud's understanding of it and how that can actually be a good thing. But there's also a balance there. So you need to find that balance. And setting boundaries is good.

[00:43:35] And the fact that Americans have become more well-versed in that is good. But there's also a culture of like divorcing your family and divorcing friends and all this just for the smallest things. And there are even people who don't even know why they've been cut off. I'm not talking about manipulative people who are playing innocent. But I'm talking about there are cases where somebody who maybe they've made mistakes, but they're overall a good person.

[00:44:02] Somebody just like shuts them out of their life and doesn't even say why. And that's, so there's, like I said, a balance here. I'm not saying have a relationship with somebody who's unhealthy. I would err on the side of actually setting more boundaries. But I'm just saying that there's a balance here. And that's just something to be aware of. I'll put this article in the show notes as well to give you a frame of reference for just giving you a different perspective. Okay? So closing message. Jesus shows us that love does not require losing ourselves.

[00:44:31] He was compassionate, but not controlled. Generous, but not depleted. Depleted, forgiving, but not enabling. And available, but not endlessly accessible. So we, like Jesus, can be compassionate, but not controlled. We, like Jesus, can be generous, but not depleted. We, like Jesus, can be forgiving, but not enabling. And forgiveness has to be organic, something we do naturally in our own time. It can't be forced. Available, but not endlessly accessible.

[00:45:00] And healthy boundaries are not a rejection of love. They are an expression of wisdom. For example, like I said in Matthew 5, 37, it says, Let your yes be yes and your no be no. And that obviously means you don't always have to say yes to people. There are balances there, and it depends on the situation. So in this talk, I will include the resources. There are psychological and scientific resources. There are faith and spiritual resources. I'll include some of the Henry Cloud resources.

[00:45:31] And if there's any podcasts or YouTube videos on setting boundaries from the past, I'll also include those in the show notes with the resources. Okay, I may have to put it in a separate document that you can click on in the show notes because the show notes have a limited space. So if I do, just note that. Okay, so that is the podcast on setting healthy boundaries. It's episode three in season six, how Jesus modeled healthy boundaries.

[00:45:58] We talked about how Jesus had strong loving boundaries, and we should too. How Jesus walked in love but never allowed others to control or manipulate him. How trauma survivors can set Christ-like boundaries, responding to pushback and guilt trips. And also the psychological side of setting boundaries and how that scripture and faith work in tandem there together. The logic of all that.

[00:46:25] And then lastly, the Henry Cloud resource and the article also. So possible calls to action, you might try saying no this week in a small way. And not just for the sake of saying no, but in a situation where you know you should. Just in a little situation, saying no to one person one time. Not for the sake of being rude, but for the sake of practicing and getting that habit going in the right situations. Your yes be yes and your no be no. So thank you so much for following me. I know I've been talking for a while.

[00:46:54] I hope this talk has been helpful. And you know as well as I do that struggling with boundaries is something most of us as empaths, codependents, highly sensitive people, survivors of trauma and abuse and neglect that we struggle with. And so I think it was important to give this from a different angle. I have talked about boundaries before, but it's good to reiterate them and talk about it some more in a different way. And so that's what I've tried to do here about Jesus modeling healthy boundaries.

[00:47:24] I hope this has been helpful. Remember, dears, you are fearfully and wonderfully made. And God loves you. And have a great day. Thank you so much for tuning in to this week's episode of Christian Emotional Recovery, hosted by Rachel Leroy. For links to this week's resources and to join the discussion, check out this episode's show notes at ChristianEmotionalRecovery.com, where you can also find links to our YouTube channel and Facebook group.

[00:47:54] Join our email list and get other episodes and resources. If you enjoyed the podcast, please rate and review the podcast and tell a friend who may benefit from this message. See you next time. And remember, beloveds, God loves you and you are fearfully and wonderfully made.